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  1. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by dragonfly View Post
    ... Add 8+8+8+8+8+8 often enough, and you'll memorize it out of sheer annoyance.
    Yes, I think it is true.

    My reasoning behind insisting that my kids memorize math facts is that I am afraid that having them do 8+8+8+8+8+8 every time for months and years will make math boring, tedious, repetitive, and less appealing to them. Just having that 6x8=48 pop up in their heads will allow them to proceed at more fun, engaging pace and be done with the problem before boredom starts. The same with addition/subtraction facts. Just learn them once and you will save yourself hours of boring repetitive tasks.

    ...but...I am not a math teacher, math has been always easy for me, so I have very limited understanding of possible issues with math...and my own DD8 might have some working memory issues and I might end up just creating 'cheat-sheets' for her, if all of our attempts at memorization through repetition/games/songs will fail.
    mom to 3 girls: DD10, DD9, DD6

  2. T4L In Forum Oct19
  3. #12

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    I think there is a window for most kids, when they are ready to memorize them. ODD memorized most of htem the summer before 3rd, and during 3rd grade. DD2 had trouble w/ addition b/c they used so many different 'strategies' and told them NOT to memorize the addition/subtraction facts, they had to use the strategies. I feel this really made math more difficult for her- she memorized all the mult. facts in 3rd grade as well, but was still counting on her fingers b/c of using strategies. I did not let her use the mult. strategies they were explaining b/c I knew it was confusing her- this was our final year of PS and I have regretted even letting her finish b/c of the addition facts thing. My twins are now in 2nd grade, and we just started multiplication (we finished MM2, and are moving into Beast and MM3 combo). They seem to love it! I am trying to keep it low-key, but they are having no problems at all getting the concept and I have even noticed them using strategies I did not teach them- one said this week, when trying to figure out 5x12... what is 24 plus 36? I did not teach that So far they have done 1, 2, 3, 5, and 10s. We are going slow, but I think they will master them in the next 12 months.

    I know I memorized all of mine in 3rd and 4th grades.
    Mom to 5 great kids~

  4. #13
    Senior Member Enlightened
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    I had to memorize them through 12s in 2nd grade. No one made any effort at making sure we "got" them. I just know them.
    DS went through the Common Core version in 3rd and 4th grade. Lots of skip-counting, estimating the answers, not really ever having to actually memorize anything. And speed quizzes, but only of the easy facts. By the end of 4th grade, his multiplication facts were still iffy, especially when he had to do them backwards to divide. So, he practiced with an app everyday that summer. By the end of the summer, he had most of them down, still not as quickly as I would hope, but good enough to move forward with long division, etc.

  5. #14
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    I went to PS. We started multiplication in 2nd and division and fractions in 3rd. I think everybody knew up to 12x12 by the time we got to long division in 4th.
    DS is in 2nd at home (but a year older than I was because of different birthday cutoffs) and we're working on them.
    I am not satisfied to let him rely on a calculator--my bff was not required to memorize the times tables (nor did her schools do very well with teaching conceptually) and finds it very inconvenient.
    Mama of one DS, class of 2026;
    recovering schoolteacher;
    lifelong bookworm

  6. #15

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    I was in 4th grade in PS in the early 1980s when I was tortured by timed tests on the multiplication tables. I love math, get a kick out of helping my teen with algebra, but still loathe the memory of that year. DS (11) is struggling with them still, and we keep a chart handy for him. He's got probably half of them committed to quick memory, the rest he has to think about for a while before he gets them. He has problems with working memory and processing speed, especially when it comes to numbers, so I'm not surprised that they're tough for him.
    Last edited by Norm Deplume; 03-07-2016 at 04:18 PM.
    Robin,
    working-at-home mother of two.
    homeschooling the 11yo boy.
    the girl is 14 (8th grade) and loves her public school.
    they are very very different kids.

  7. #16

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    I dont ever remember timed tests, but it was 4th grade for me, and only up through 10.

    For DS, we have used Singapore for math, he learned 2s, 5s, 10s (if those count), and possibly 3s in 2nd grade (3a and b workbooks), and the rest of them in 3rd grade. (Unless it was 1st and 2nd grade.) We started Kindergarten with 1a and b, So our years are one off the grade level.

    Lots of multiplication dice game. How else do you get your kid to enthusiastically drill 15-20 mult problems in a minute, then do 10 trials of it and be looking forward to more?
    Homeschooling DS13, DS6.

    Atheist.

    My spelling was fine, then my brain left me.

  8. #17

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    Third grade for me, through the 12s. M1 is working through them much more slowly, but hopefully will get through the 10s by year's end.

    He really has to learn his core facts with manipulatives- touching them and using them to solve problems over and over for anything to stick. My attempts to show him any of the shortcuts in multiplying have all failed. So we plod on with the cuisenaire rods.
    FKA Hordemama
    Stay-at-home-librarian parenting a horde of two sons: Marauder 1 (M1) born in 2007, and Marauder 2 (M2) born in 2012.

  9. #18

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    I know I knew them by sometime in second grade, but I don't really remember learning them. My eldest and I worked on them in second grade: she understood the process but memorizing the facts really improved her accuracy in multiplying multi-digit numbers, long division, and working with fractions. She's a very mathy kid, though.

  10. #19
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    I remember timed tests in second and third grade. I hated them so much because everyone else always finished theirs and slapped their papers down so proudly while I was still on the first or second row. What a nightmare. We were supposed to memorize them in third, but I never could. I don't think you automatically memorize 8+8+8+8+8 over time. I never did. I used to draw pictures in the margins or write out a long list to help me count. I got the right answers, and that's what got the teachers off my back.

    Long division was awful. Took forever. I can do it, but yeah I've gotta do the adding for multiplication. Like 482/7 (random numbers) - I'll think: I know 7x7 is 49, so the first ones gotta be 7x6. That's 14, 28, 29303132333435(fingers) 35, 36373839404142(fingers) 42. 48-42 is six. Seven into sixty two. Well 7x7 is 49, 50515253545556, 57585960616263, okay so 8. With a remainder of 1. And when we went to decimals I keeled over and died.
    I'm a work-at-home mom to three, homeschool enthusiast, and avid planner fueled by lattes and Florida sunshine. My oldest is 6 and is a fircond grader (that's somewhere between first and second, naturally), my preschooler just told me she wants to learn how to read, and my toddler is a force of nature.

    I gather all kinds of secular homeschool resources and share them at TheHomeschoolResourceRoom.com.

  11. #20

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    Thanks everyone! It really does look like reading, only a bit later. I really want people to not freak out when their kid doesn't get them all memorized in 2nd grade. That is still normal.

    Our charter type school is offering a class for parents and kids who are having issues learning multiplication. At some point I took a class with a different teacher there who said that she read a study about how researchers tried to teach 4 year olds the calendar. The kids practiced, and practiced, and eventually, after several months, got it. The researchers taught the same skills to 1st graders. They practiced, and after several weeks, they got it. So my thought is....why spend time practicing and practicing for months or even years, when it can be done easily when they are older. And meanwhile...they can do other stuff that is more age appropriate.

    The issue I have with the class that the teacher is going to teach is that she didn't define when it IS a problem that the kids don't have their multiplication. And...I could care less if a person wants to do the stuff in their head or on a calculator at the store....(one of her arguments for being fluent.) But mostly....I want kids to feel successful, and not feel that they are stupid because they are being pushed to do something that they are not developmentally ready to do.

    Thanks again to all who have replied, and I hope to see more responses!

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When did YOU (and your kids) "get"  multiplication facts?