View Full Version : Disparate verbal and nonverbal IQ

Accidental Homeschooler
08-28-2011, 05:38 PM
My dd had her 6yr physical last week and I was filling her doctor in on hsing and why we are doing it, problems in school... I mentioned that we had had her tested and her verbal IQ was very high (97th percentile) and her nonverbal was pretty solidly average (50something percentile). He said there was a learning disability associated with this type of disparity and wondered if they had diagnosed anything (they did not). The psychologists we worked with for the testing also said that five is young for an IQ test. There will be movement and we should re-test when she is older. This was part of her psych-ed evaluation. Anyway I started looking for more information and found one article that suggested that this may be consistent with Aspergers, especially if there are behavior problems also (we do have some of them). I also read that there is some disagreement over whether disparaties like this are LD's or not. Some kids are opposite, high nonverbal, low verbal. So I am wondering if anyone else has had similar results with testing and if there was a diagnosis with it. I am mostly thinking that if this is a LD or Aspergers I would like (as her teacher) to get some more information.

08-28-2011, 08:12 PM
One of the BEST sources in the nation for assistance with and information on twice exceptional children (and adults) is the Gifted Development Center in Denver, CO. Their website is full of information. http://gifteddevelopment.com/What_is_Gifted/2echildren.htm

My son is 2E, as identified by the GDC in 2008. Best of luck!

08-28-2011, 08:30 PM
We had some disparities like that and the evaluator labled it 'processing disorder not otherwise specified'. We just teach him where he needs to learn . . .

08-28-2011, 10:01 PM
There is something called Nonverbal Learning Disability where this discrepancy is one of the hallmarks.

One thing I did when I had some puzzling scores for my then 7 year old son was to have a phone consultation with the Gifted Development Center. At the time, my son's IQ didn't indicate anything even remotely approaching giftedness, but they took me seriously and gave me some excellent advice, including the opinion that I wasn't crazy to think he might be gifted. It cost about $200 for two hours (I think) back about 7 years ago. That conversation definitely got us moving in the right direction with regard to more targeted evaluations and eventually therapies and remediation.

08-28-2011, 10:12 PM
I don't have any answers but I do have a few questions that you might think about. Was the person evaluating your daughter a licensed psychologist with a PhD? Some but not all "school psychologists" who do IQ testing have only a masters degree and may have actually missed the complexity of your child and any diagnosis (though, I'm not trying to malign all master's level school psychologists). Also, was the psychologist just a typical psychologist (with a PhD) but not a pediatric neuropsychologist? Although you won't want to have her tested in the same way again anytime soon, you might want to consider how a different evaluation (if you can afford it) may benefit you. If you're concerned about Asperger's or a learning disorder, a pediatric neuropsychologist is really your best bet to get a thorough evaluation (not just IQ testing) with specific recommendations about how she will learn best or what other ideas may help her. Here is a link to a brochure that describes what a pediatric neuropsychologist is, and does: www.div40.org/pdf/PedNeuropscyhBroch3.pdf
Hope this helps!

Accidental Homeschooler
08-29-2011, 04:06 AM
Sometimes I feel as if I am parenting a little girl shaped rubik's cube. She is one puzzle after another and I feel like I am finally putting the pieces together a bit. I am sure visual processing is the problem/weakness and auditory is the strength. I think it is more than just a preferred learning style. She really has a lot of trouble with visual information. I can see it with teaching her to read. We did go to the center for gifted education a the U here, so not a school psychologist. I think I will call them tomorrow though with some questions about pursuing this farther. The school NEVER would have gotten this. They were already talking ODD. They really couldn't see past the behavior. Thank God (or you know, whoever) that we took her out of school. And thank you all for the responses and links!

08-29-2011, 07:02 AM
My son also had a visual processing disorder. He basically had stopped using his right eye. There are behavioral optometrists that can help her. He went through 6 months of VP therapy and is doing great in that department. I totally understand the Rubiks Cube analogy.

08-29-2011, 08:58 AM
I would hesitate on the Asperger's idea without further info, although yes, it could be. PDD-NOS (as stated above, also considered part of the autism spectrum, I believe) would be more likely knowing what I know from my wife's experience as a pediatric OT. Definitely get more info if you feel this is something that's impacting her learning.

Accidental Homeschooler
08-29-2011, 09:10 AM
I will ask about that clanclariens, thanks! Dd also has vision probems. With her it is tracking.

Accidental Homeschooler
08-29-2011, 09:18 AM
I would hesitate on the Asperger's idea without further info, although yes, it could be. PDD-NOS (as stated above, also considered part of the autism spectrum, I believe) would be more likely knowing what I know from my wife's experience as a pediatric OT. Definitely get more info if you feel this is something that's impacting her learning.

From what I read (and it was three in the morning, so I was a bit bleary) there is some disagreement about Aspergers vs nonverbal learning disability and what you get can depend largely on who you go to. A psychiatrist/psychologist will be more likely to say Aspergers and a neuropsychologist will be more likely to say nonverbal learning disorder. Every once in a while I will read a post from someone with a child who has been diagnosed with Aspergers and experience a brain ping because it sounds like my dd. But when I go and read more about Aspergers, it just doesn't fit.

08-29-2011, 10:11 AM
Asperger's is weird because it can mean so many different things. It's not cut-and-dried like some other conditions. That's why I sort of resisted the notion that Hurricane was for a while, because there were some things that didn't fit. But too many do fit, and it just makes the most sense. If your gut feeling tells you it's the wrong dx, then it probably is. (Wrong, that is.)

08-29-2011, 09:08 PM
Here's a link for you. These folks usually do a pretty extensive eval. It's actually amazing to watch.

08-29-2011, 10:32 PM
Interesting thread. I wonder what this "looks" like. As in I am not understanding how it manifests. So really I have nothing to offer, only to take from this discussion. Sorry.

I've never done any testing, and was curious what lead you to think that testing was needed. Guess there are several on this thread that could answer for their kiddos.

Accidental Homeschooler
08-30-2011, 11:38 AM
We got the testing becuase dd was having problems in school and I knew that the school would be pushing for testing soon. I also felt that she was bored and telling the school this was inviting pooh, poohing and eye rolling(I had already experienced this with my older daughter) like, "Oh, here is another parent who wants to think their child is brilliant..." The school was also getting attached to the idea that she was ODD and I knew this was not the explanation and wanted to put it to rest. So, I guess basically, testing was going to give me some ammunition in advocating for dd to the school. The testing did put the ODD as an explanation to rest. At the time we wanted school to work for her, though I did talk to the evaluators about other educational plans (private or home schooling). I guess I was also hoping for some answers for myself.